テラ強そうｗｗｗｗｗｗ

強すぎるだろ・・・
興奮しまくるぅ・・・・・・・・ゼ

まだ　２０ｗｗ

＠50ｗｗ

頑張るべ～～～～応援宜しくｗｗ

７００％とかつよすぎですｗｗ

でも速度が遅いらしいですよ＾＾；

まぁそれを差し引いても強いと思いますがｗ

７００％で６体かよ・・・・ｶﾞﾝ涙目；；

さっさと3次したいぜｗｗｗ
と思った時にはサクきれたｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗ

ニコニコ動画でこのスキル使ってるのみたけど
そんなに遅くないように感じました。パンチとかダブルアッパーが遅いせいでしょうか。。

速度が遅い、段差が越えられない、そして四次のドラゴンストライクと被ることからこれはいらないと思う。
ドラゴンストライクが通常状態で使えるのに対してこれはトランス時にしか使えないしな。

銃使いですがこれはメイポ中に
　　
　　　　ｙ=-(´∀`)`;:.’ﾀｰﾝ

　　　　　　　する必要がありそうですね

えぇぇぇぇぇぇぇぇ強!!!

↑の名前がクヌギサーバーでつかってるので　　　　　できれば友録よろ～＾＾

はぁ～～～３次いけるかな・・・

>>8
速度遅くないんですけど・・・

MAXで７００％×６って・・・3次スキルではやばいですね・・・

SL6で５ｋでたんですけど・・・
MAXにちかずけば１０ｋでるとおもうとうれしいなぁ

たぶんトランスは4次になってもつかうとおもうからＭＡＸ推奨ですね

っていうか･･･700％で6対攻撃なんて興奮するじゃん、撃ちたくなるじゃんｗ

スーパートランスフォーム時にはショックウェーブ、デモリッション、スナッチしか使えないのでスナッチ→ショックウェーブのコンボで4次でも十分使える！！･･･かと思いきや、エネルギー攻撃は使えるので、確かに4次での出番は少ないかと思われます。
ですが、やっぱり3次で4次並みの火力が出るというのは圧巻ですし、狩場によっては基本デモリッションなのであまりエネルギーが溜まらない→範囲の場合はスナッチ→ショックコンボが有効　だと考えれば少しは4次での使い道も残されている？ような気がします。
まぁ自分はマスターまで上げますよｗ

まだ77LVで１６しかあげてないけど一発平均8000超えたｗｗｗ

Ｌ１で使用してみました、速度は約３０発／分攻撃範囲はＤＫのスラッシャー並（それより広いかも？）、これで今後主力狩場になるであろう敵を考えると、ＭＡＸになるころにはサイティ、ホムンまでは１～２発、バグが２～３発。結構使えるんちゃうの？というのが感想です。なによりサイヤ人の攻撃する姿はかっこいいｗｗ

サイヤならんとできんのかぁ・・・
まぁかっちょいいな

まだ１しか上げてないですが、２次のディレイの長さもあり、そこまで使いづらいスキルではありませんでした。
威力も文句ないですが、消費MPがやや多いので、それに見合った狩り場を選ぶ必要がありそうです。

ﾏﾁﾞやばいぐらいつよいだろｗｗ

ｶﾞﾝﾊﾞって3次しよｗｗ

ｼｮｯｸｳｪｲﾌﾞは4次でも十分使えるスキルです。
ﾄﾞﾗｺﾞﾝｽﾄﾗｲｸとかぶるという意見もありますが、
ﾄﾗﾝｽ時にはｽﾅｯﾁ･ﾃﾞﾓﾘｼｮﾝ･各種ｴﾈﾙｷﾞｰ系しか使えないため、
範囲攻撃のｼｮｯｸｳｪｲﾌﾞはとても使いやすいです。
また、発動の遅さは4次ｽｷﾙのｳｨﾝﾄﾞﾌﾞｰｽﾀｰにより早くなります。
姫などの集め狩りではﾄﾞﾗｺﾞﾝｽﾄﾗｲｸよりも発動が早く使いやすいと感じました。
なので、ｼｮｯｸｳｪｲﾌﾞはﾏｯｸｽまであげることをお勧めします。

↑だよね

まぁ２０ｋ以上はそのうち誰でも出せる

同じくＳＷは４次でも使えます。バイパーのスキル振りにもよりますが。４次でもＳＷを主力に使うには、Ｓトラを８まで
早めに上げトランスと同じ２分始動４分待機にします、これにより計算上は１時間中４０分ＳＷが打てます。変身中の集め
にはドレイン、スナッチ１があればそう問題はないかと。あと段差の問題。これは、高ＬＶになれば、狩場は決まってくる
のでＳＷを打ちやすいポイントを覚える程度で普通に使えます。
ＳＷ主力でかりながら、ドラストを育てるのもいいし、ドラストを後に回しにしてオーブに振ってもいいと思います。
いずれにしてもＳＷは４次前半では十分主力のスキルですよ。

＞２４さんと同じ考えで、４次でもSWの使いどころは十分あります
WBをかけて速度を上げるとSWも連射できますので
段差にだけ注意していけば４次前半の主力スキルとなります

ドラゴンストライクより発動が早いので、使いどころは多いです。MAX推奨ですｗ

絶対ＭＡＸにしたほうがいいですｗｗｗ　　　　　　　　　　狩りの効率めっちゃ上がりました

ぼくいま４０れべでがんばってますは約3字てんしょくしてつかってみたいですねー

700％とヵｗ
まじやヴぇｗ
うわぁ、うらやましいｗ

たぶん先上げとはいかないけど前半から30にしといた方がいいと思います　
あえて言うなら100前後までに
後半上げようとすると4次まであまり使えないと．．．
まぁ4次になっても使えるかもしれないけどｗ

100でショックウェイブ43kでました。

ほほぉー　で能力やら装備やら教えてもらおうか

>>30
俺にも見せてほしいわ
SSプリーズ!

８１LVのSW先上げバッカニアです。
SWの最高攻撃力は１６Kほどで、この数字だけを聞くととても恐ろしいように聞こえますが･･･
実際はとても使いにくいスキルです＾＾；

第一に、発動に時間がかかりすぎることです。
これによってD子のナイフなどはほぼ避けられません＾＾；
上にジャンプしている間に攻撃を受けると結構KBするので、元の位置に戻って撃つのは非常に面倒です。

そして最も悪いのが、坂があるとそこで止まってしまうということです。
ケンタなどのマップでも坂が多数あるので、自慢の範囲を最大限に生かすのはかなり難しいです。

しかし、このショックウェーブは意外と上判定があり、軽い二段構造なら上の敵も全滅させることができます。
そしてスキル自体は遅いですが、スキル後のディレイは一切ありません。一応連射できます。

ただ、３次の間はトランス中に使えるスキルが乏しく、スタンマスタリーも適応されない（３次のうちはトランス状態で気絶させられるスキルがない）ので、狩には相当のテクニックがヒツヨウです。

しかしそれらのことを考慮に入れても、スキルに振ればバカスカ強くなってくれるSWはとても楽しいです（ﾉω`

エネルギーバスターはMAXにしてもパンチの最大ですから、二次の最大攻撃力を抜けないので･･･

いまショックウェイブ３･･･

ＬＶ78でショックウェーブ(20ＬＶです)
　１１ｋいくんですけど弱いですか？

↑ショックウェイブだった＾＾；

77ショックウェイブ(11)で9kって普通ですか？

現在８３ＬＶ、ＳＷ先上げバッカニアです。
狩場について書き込ませていただきます。

ＳＷは上げ始めは攻撃力がそれほど高くなく、ディレイが多く使いにくいですが、マガティアのグルクエでホルスの目を手に入れようと思えば８０ＬＶ近くなるので、いがいと心配は要りません。

そこで今回ＳＷの餌食になってくれるのはケンタです☆
しかし人気の赤ケンタやら青ケンタやらは坂が多くてかれませぬ

そこで平地の多い“水と闇の戦場”もしくはケンタのミニマップ“ケンタウロスの円卓”をオススメします。
どちらも平面に４～６体の敵が沸くことが多く、ＳＷにもってこいです。

また、ＳＷはジャンプ撃ちすることで移動しながら打つことが出来ます。（弓のジャンプショットのように若干のテクニックが必要ですが）
８０ＬＶのＳＷで１１０ＬＶのＤＫのＤスラッシャー並みの攻撃力がでるので、かなり快感ですよ☆

ケンタのミニマップって何処？

>>39へ

Maple wiki より
リプレ/火と水の戦場　から行ける。
地形は火と水の戦場と同様。
上段にフリーズケンタウロス。中段にバーンケンタウロス、下段にケンタウロスが湧く。
湧きは青>闇>赤

　ショックウェーブジャンプしながら打てるって聞いたんすができません；；

誰かやり方教えてくれませんか？

>>41
ジャンプと同時に押すことで出来ますよ。空中では出来ません。あしからず；

＠普通に(SW２Lvずつ＆普通育成)あげるのであれば
80Lv時点でおそらく9kぐらいが目安かと

今75のバッカニアなんです＾＾　ＳＷ先上げ＾＾

90の友が15Kだしてた件

スキル修正でトランスフォームの状態でも通常スキルが使えるようになるらしいのですが、それを考えるとショックウェーブは捨てスキル候補から外すべきでしょうか？
トランスフォームの状態で通常スキルも使えるのなら、ショックウェーブ＋ドラゴンストライクで複数の敵をかたずけるのが楽になりそうと思うんですが・・・

すみません、「ショックウェーブ」ではなくてショックウェイブでした

SWは四次してもDストより発動早いから使うと思いますよ。

SWをMAXにして損は無いでしょう。

>47
返信ありがとうございます！
今はまだ95で、4次まで時間あるのでゆっくり考えていこうと思います

　ショックウェイブ捨てとか言ってる人何なんでしょうかｗ
　確かに攻撃速度は遅いけど、十分に主力スキルになります。
　命中と火力があれば、レベが低くても峰狩れますし。
　MAX確定だと思いますが。

>>49
ショックウェーブの長所
威力が高い
範囲攻撃
短所
地形に弱い
速度が遅い
使用に制限がある

ショックウェーブが使えるといえる条件は
地形が平面
沸きが良い
あたりかな

まぁ捨てる、使うは人の勝手かな

シグナス（ストライカー）のショックウエイブは
ＭＡＸ650㌫らしいです

もうすぐショックウェイブはスキル強化パッチで捨てスキルになるかな？

変身中にパンチ使えれば、姫のショックウエイブ狩りはかなり効率良くなるとおもうよ。

>>52
むしろ本領発揮といわざるを得ない。
パンチと組み合わせることでダメージ無効化、足が遅いという欠点もスキルの移動でカバーされ、多少の地形（坂など）でも戦えるようになる。
またバックエルボーやダブルアッパーも使えるようになるわけで、４次になる前からスタンマスタリーを適用できる。

そしてなにより４次でドラストとドラストの間に挟むことで無駄なく対団体にかなりの威力がだせる。両方「連続使用できない」のがマイナス効果のスキルだったからなぁ…

これやっと修正バッチでほかスキル可能になって使いどころ出てきましたね　振ってない人どまいです　　神殿とかでバンチ→ｓｗ→ムーンサルト→ｓｗ　　っていうコンボでいいですね＾＾；　　　バンチの代わりにバックエルポーもいいかもです

SWを捨ててオークに振るというのはどうでしょうか？　SW２１という中途半端なレベルだとあまり使えない気がするのですが・・・＾＾；

SWはたしかに使うならMAX欲しいですね。
これまではまったく使いませんでしたが
スキル修正も入ったので
4次で余裕が出てきた今では（当方150レベ）
そろそろMAX欲しくなるかもです。
自分もSW21にしましたけど
これから4次スキルｐで振るかもです。

なので、オークを振りたければ
2次のダブルアッパーあたりを削るといいんじゃないかな？そうすればストレートにもまわせますよー

話聞いてると俺まだ７１レベでショックウェイブ３しか上げてないし　８０００しか出ない俺って雑魚ですか？

シャークウェブよりこっちあげたほうがいいんですか？

やっと三次しました＾＾。
けど、ショックウェーブを３０までふるのがとてもたいへんです。まぁ、がんばります。

ぉれは＠２Ｌｖだぜｗ

早く100LVになりたいなぁｗ＠3LV！がんばるぞぉ～

７・７００・・・
ちょっとけたはずれてませんか？？

これを80LVにMAXにするとします　
拳はSTR極であげてSTR397　D20　ですね
戦士はSTR極でSTR413です
装備は80の武器で拳はスチールルノA66AS5だ
戦士は鉾と槍あるけどスラッシャーだから鉾の月牙刀A92AS7ね　

一回とぎりま

で拳のウェイブは3992～12070になる
平均8031ってとこだ
DKのスラッシャーは1884～5793だから
平均3838って所だなーこの時点では負けてる
でも攻撃速度は　　　どうだ？
DKは1分に約70回　　拳は1分に約30回だぜ
DKは268660ダメ　　　拳は240930だ
やっぱDK最強！！！！！！！！！！！！！
てことでDストとかぶるしいらないと思うよ

バトルシップと同じ人ですかね？
DKのスラッシャーは強制振り下ろしなので突きの最低ダメージはでませんよ
なのでスラッシャーは3128～5793
平均ダメ4460、分間70回として312232と冒険家3次職の中ではダントツです

でも拳はスラッシャー使えない(当然だけど)のでショックウェイブ振る価値はありますよ
3次後半きつい時期の楽しみになりますし

ところで、先ほどからステータスと武器から計算してどうも攻撃力が一致しないのですがどのように計算してますか？
職拳.STR397.DEX20.武器66を
(STR×4.8+DEX)×攻撃力/100
にはめ込むとSW8900止まりなんですが･･･

よくわからないがどうして拳とＤＫ比べているの？
拳やってる人って”好きで”やっているんです

ＤＫの方が強いと思うならそっちやってればいいじゃん
どうして拳のところをわざわざ見に来てるんでしょうか？
不思議でなりません

拳やりたいの？ＤＫ強いから皆にしてほしいの？

ちなみに今はアランのせい(おかげ)で鉾書が高騰しています
ナックル書は依然安いままです

これはオンラインゲームです
強化は拳の方が楽ですよ？

ただ文面を見ていると”やっぱDK最強!”とか言ってる辺りから頭弱そうです
釣り、でしたかね？

↑ﾅｲｽｺﾒﾝﾄですなｂｂ

ドーンドーンドーンってくるからいいよぅ

今コメ21みたいなのみると涙が出てくるな

スキル修正あってSWと性能の似てるＤストの高速化により、ＳＷは完璧に捨てスキルになったと思うのだが。どうだろう？

ＳＷが使えるとすれば、100レベルぐらいでの平地での姫狩りくらいか？
160↑ぐらいになってＳＷの必要性を言い出してる人いるけど、160↑ならＳＷ使わないでしょ？
だってパンチ⇒Ｄストで無敵攻撃続けられちゃうしね。
しかも拳ってＳＰあまらないんだし、4次のＳＰを3次に回すのは非現実的だと思う。

3次ではＳＷを削ることをオススメするが、ＳＷ21ではＳＷ30でも使えないと思う現在まるでゴミスキルだと思います。
ＳＷ21ふるぐらいなら、2次で振れなかったスキルにＳＰ9回して2次スキルをすべてＭＡＸにしたほうがよくありません？
それでＳＷ12ですが、どうせなら1次スキルのダッシュやらストーレトを捨てたならそちらをＭＡＸにして。。
ＳＷはネタとして残りのＳＰを振ってＳＷ2かＳＷ3で十分だと思います。

全く同意です。
ただ、見た目のいいスキルなので
捨てるのが惜しくなる気持ちはありますよね笑
21だと６匹にあたる得点があるくらいでしょうか。

ショックを仮に取るとしたら変身して戦うことになるので
スナッチも欲しくなりそうですよね～

いろいろ選択肢があって
拳は楽しいです！

ストレートに回すって…
なぜ３次なら使えるスキルを捨てて３次でも使わないスキルをあげる必要があるんだ？？

範囲攻撃してると、１，２匹狩り残ることがあります。
そんなときに、出の早い単体攻撃を織り交ぜると、小気味好い狩りになるからです。
狩りスタイルによるので、捨てる捨てないは好みの問題ですね。

1次も2次も3次もスキルポイントたりないんだし、
3次の削るスキルを完璧に捨てて1次と2次スキルを完璧にするってのがいいとおもうんだが。

そうなると自分的には削るのはショックウェーブ。
3次中はエネルギー系が主力。
SWは、とにかく発動が遅い。
4次のDストの方がすべての点で完全に上位
Dスト→SWのコンボは現在反撃を食らう
パンチ→Dストの連続で完全無敵

見た目のかっこいいショックウェーブは1か2振って
ネタスキルでいいと思います。

俺はドレイン削ってSWmaxにしたぜ！ホンスターという奇跡の薬が出た今となっては回復のための攻撃などやってられん！姫武器庫がマイホームの俺にとってSWは神スキルも同然だｗ４次になった今キーにセットもしていないが悔いは無い！逆にSWなしで３次のマゾ期を乗り越えることを考えたら･･･ぞっとするぜ･･･

いまのバスターの高性能っぷりは、4次してもバスターはキー設定するぐらいです。

ホンスターが出たところで、ドレインとMPリカバリーのコンボは3次でも4次でも最強です。
道場やクリスタルクエなどで重宝しますよ。

強化パッチにより三次の主力は気絶＆連射可能になったバスタ１本。
オーブを4次で覚えても、バスタは使えます。

ショックウェーブは発動おそすぎ＆制限が厳しい。
>>77のようにショックウェーブMAXでも4次では使わない。
それなら、4次でも使えるドレイン＆バスタをMAX
そして、21までしかあげられないショックウェーブは更に使えないので、
1次2次の振れなかったスキルへ回すのがいい。

というかライディングあるしダッシュいらなくね？
１０だが勝手に発動してまじ邪魔なんだけど

普通は２１止めです。
4次にドラゴンストライクがありますし、なにより攻撃速度が遅すぎて発動→敵突進→ウワァー→チーンです。
これをＭＡＸにするより、エネルギーバスターをＭＡＸにしたほうが３次は楽です。

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